Check out the different lie angles of a standard 8 iron from these three companies: I know that the difference between these angles doesnt seem like much. It can be re-bent without any adverse effect on it. Thats why I recommend that golfers get fit for irons on golf radar by a certified fitter who understands how loft and COG work together in iron design. Sure. Ball speed from the new irons is what is creating the distance. I have mine bent 2 degrees strong and cannot see any visible difference. The one with a ballflight too high, is delivering the clubhead Currently I play a set of old-school Ping Eye 2s, which I love, but I want the benefits of modern irons and forged heads. In The BagDriver: TaylorMade M2 (2017) w/ Project X T1100 HZRDUS Handcrafted 65xStrong 3 wood: Taylormade M1 15* w/ ProjectX T1100 HZRDUS handcrafted 75x3 Hybrid: Adams PRO 18* w/ KBS Tour Hybrid S flex tipped 1/2"4 Hybrid: Adams PRO 20* (bent to 21*) w/ KBS Tour Hybrid S flex tipped 1/2"4-AW: TaylorMade P770 w/ Dynamic Gold Tour Issue Black Onyx S400. Hope I did not complicate this any and maybe helped you, Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha Speeder 565 R flex---- 3 wood TM V-Steel Aldila 65G R Flex 15*--- 7 Wood TM V-Steel UST Pro Force 65 R flex 21*---- 9 wood TM V-Steel stock MAS Stiff shaft 24*--- Irons 4 thru 9 Mac Muirfield TT black label --- PW Vokey SM-4 51* stock shaft--- SW Vokey SM 5 L grind 58* stock shaft--- Putter -- Rusty Scotty Santa Fe fluted Bulls Eye shaft---. Driver- Tmag 2017 M2 tour issue 8.5* actual loft 7.8* w/ HZRDS Green PVD 70TX" Its like that distance is just not filled. Arnold Palmer Invitational 2023 (*** NO LIV DISCUSSIONS/REFERENCES ***), Custom Ping i230 5-UW KBS Tour R+ Power Spec, G425 3 wood with GD TP, Ping Kaili Shaft,King Tec Hybrid, Jaws Raw & Zipcore Wedge, Airmax 97, Apex UW. Driver: Charles Kelley whats in the bag accurate as of the Pebble Beach Pro-Am. But the end result for an iron fitting is the same: I want the customer to leave with a set of irons that produce the best possible launch conditions for them. -How much do you vary on club delivery for Angle or attack and Dynamic loft? Simply put, bending the iron 6.5 degrees strong wasn't an option. I have a 2 iron bent 2 strong to 16. I am constantly amazed at how many golfers are trying to play the game with a fundamentally unsound hold of the club. Generall, Dont worry and overthink this like most doo. Its ball speed not loft that is increasing distance. Step 3. 1 for 1, loft for bounce. On GI long irons vs players irons have different width soles, are the effects of bounce differ between the two if the loft is a degree stronger? But i am talking more along the lines of the bounce, leading edge, etc. Weakening lofts makes zero sense to me. It is a lot easier to find what lie angle you need in your golf clubs and purchase a set rather than have to individually bend each club. 16,822. Bending lofts to 2 degrees stronger - WRX Club Techs - GolfWRX When my first 'proper' set of clubs (MP30s) were done - at the same time as a Driver Shaft fitting - a couple were out considerably (the 6 iron had the loft of a 5!)! I am a good long iron player and prefer them over fairway woods and especially hybrids. This will reduce any penalty shots and subsequently the number of doubles-or-worse in your round. We dont stop playing the game because we get old; we get old because we stop playing the game.. Military. with more loft than its designed for, so he cant go wrong by bending heads stronger. At 100 mph you are obliterating the ground. I am 2 handicap, playing Scottish Links golf, smooth tempo, 80-90mph, pretty straight flight, shallow divot. That would depend on what GI head design you have and to be quite honest the only way to be sure would be to test these irons on a golf radar. NOW AVAILABLE: GolfWRX G/Fore Hats and Holderness & Bourne Polos! Upload or insert images from URL. Upload or insert images from URL. Will the clubs dig more or enough to tell a difference? Bending the hosel toward or away from the face plane, opens or closes the clubs face angle. I can't say that they have kicked my 716 ap2 out for good, but for now the 716 cb are staying in the bag! So glad this was posted. Driver: GolfWRX is on the ground in Orlando ahead of the 2023 Arnold Palmer Invitational at Bay Hill Club & Lodge. Hes learned nothing Olympic legend launches scathing attack on Tiger Woods over tampon apology, Golf fans left bemused following bizarre Jim Nantz blunder, Best driver 2023: Expert club fitters recommend the best driver for your swing speed, An UP-CLOSE look at Tiger Woods famous Scotty Cameron putter, David Feherty ridiculed for Greg Norman comment during LIV broadcast, Tour pro says LIV would be done if Brooks Koepka returned to PGA Tour, TOUR REPORT: McIlroy switches drivers during Genesis Invitational (plus Tigers iron change). Generally bending lofts on irons unless you are tweaking them to even out a gap. If your Ball Speed was higher than that, say up to 125, which is a few MPH slower than PGA Tour average, you would want spin to stay within 200-300 RPMs higher, and Launch Angle to come down to about 14*. The Ever Changing Bag! About time someone who knows what theyre talking about said what the the real deal is with loft and modern clubs. See below the make percentage for an average golfer from varying distances. Offset degrees especially with a long iron can be a factor along with sole design. A golf club can be bent two degrees flat when the lie angle is lowered and the heel of the club is raised to a position that is higher than the toe of the club. 5-G But there is a lot more to it than that. Featured Section: As far as lofts for amateurs go, I feel like long irons have to little difference between them. GolfWRX_Official Will I be digging too much? In the fittings I do on a golf radar, I see all types of swings and golfers of different ability levels, so the variances in fittings can be dramatic. Bending the loft is another story. Its taking up to 2 degrees off each iron. I wouldn't feel comfortable messing with the bounce/offset/loft. Show Your True Colors With Mitchell Golfs Custom Color Program. If experience still trumps explanations, simulations and printouts, print out some ebay listings there are lots of older sets with barely used 3 irons. Taylor Made Stealth 10.5 Aldila Ascent Red R flex, Wilson D7 forged 5-GW- Mamiya recoil 460 R flex, Titleist Pro VIxoptic yellow with revkev stamped on them. The industry is run by marketing divisions, who are responsible for stronger lofted irons, in the mistaken belief that lower loft equals more distance. I have to explain that the design allows the iron to have a stronger loft. Remember, the set is not necessarily progressively consistent from one club to another, and therefore each club should be checked. Brent Grantcould very well be one of the seasons fairy stories by September, having already secured his 2022/23 card with a stunning 50-foot birdie putt on the last hole of the Korn Ferry Tour Championship enough to finish 11th and sneak in. 3" = 4.6* and 6" = 9.2* change in loft. The 2-degree limit is only recommended when changing the lofts on irons due to the potential effect such bends will have on the sole angle of the club. Older irons can be bent to achieve better gaping and additional distance, but the distance increases will be very small. By Forged irons should be checked every year or 2 anyway for loft/lie. So going 2 strong will remove 2 degrees of bounce. But if a high spin player gets a 15 launch and 6000 RPM with a 115 MPH ball speed with a 5-iron, then whats wrong with that? Some people prefer a higher or lower, high- or low-spin ball flight for strategic purposes. However, in reality it was now a 63* wedge so what happened. Hi everyone, sorry for the slow reply! As a lifelong golfer, a student of the game and having made my living in the golf equipment industry for 40-plus years, I have made it a study to observe golfers of all skill levels as they try to figure out this crazy and very difficult game. I even fitted a customer with a new SLDR and put him in a 12 degree head with a TP shaft. Keep the loft the same and take an extra club for the shot. well unfortunately people buy clubs based on their ego and the club manufactures feed it. We dive into a subject we get A LOT of questions about, bending your clubs properly. Machines with fixed measuring gauges will not be accurate when measuring clubs with offset, progressive offset, or face progression hosel positions. Feel free to browse around and see if anything catches your eye! Hi all, I was wondering if bending a club 2* strong would affect the playability of said club? question on bending a forged iron 2 degrees strong By ssfranny, January 22, 2019 in WRX Club Techs Reply to this topic Start new topic ssfranny Lefty Boomers 3.5k Feedback 20 0 0 Total Rating 100% Posted January 22, 2019 Have a set of basically new MP 53s I want to bend them 2 degrees strong to make them play more a modern loft. Distance is fine, but I have an overly high flight in the wind. The G30 is a high-launching game improvement design. You will see it often when a pro, for example, will eliminate his 4 iron from the set and they may strengthen their 5 iron a degree or two and weaken their 3 iron a degree or two to even out the gaps. Yes, it is possible to bend the irons 1-2 degrees stronger, but by doing so you would be reducing the effective bounce on the clubs. The question is, again, Do you really want to get better at golf?. The two things are diametrically opposed in meaning of course. Each player is different and because of this each iron plays different for each player. Golfers can see their spin rate drop thousands of RPMs from the rough (depending on the rough and type of lie), so being able to keep their shots in the air with enough spin to stop the ball on the green can be a huge part of helping them shoot lower scores. Nick so, how much difference can CoG location make to the optimum loft? Well-regarded at home, he mixed his time in junior golf with the likes of Min Woo Lee and Curtis Luck, during which he finishedrunner-up at The Players Amateur before winning the elite Porter Cup and being part of the victorious three-man Australian team at the Eisenhower Trophy, played partly at El Chamaleon, scene of the Mayokaba events on the PGA Tour. This feels like an anyone week the back-nine on Sunday could be fun. I was wondering if bending my irons 1 to 2 degrees strong at a golf shop will change the playability of the 712 AP2s. A lot of mixing and matching While you might prefer the overlap, interlock or full-finger style, the hold on the golf club is pretty much the same the upper portion of the grip has to be under the pad of the upper hand and held more in the fingers than the palm of both hands. 2023 Acushnet Company. I was 50 yards out on the 3rd hole, and was in the moguls. Epoxy Curing Times for Golf Clubs, Work Life and Shear Strength. Think about how much this could help golfers from the rough as well. Your email address will not be published. ** Due to coronavirus and the work restrictions in place here in Michigan, for international orders, please email info@mitchellgolf.com for a complete quote. That said, people will usually launch clubs higher with a longer shaft length as well, (mechanical advantage/physics) so again, it kind of goes hand in hand with the stronger lofts. OK, quick question. 716 MB'S It sorts my gapping out perfectly as a result. And the opposite is true as the speed drops. Ping G425 5 wood & hybrid Like you said, it will change the bounce but other than that, it wont change much and shouldnt effect the playability of the club unless you are really steep and need the bounce. That's what I did with my 4i: took out the 95 gram KBS shaft and replaced it with a 75-gram SteelFiber 780 HLS hybrid shaft. I take healthy beaver pelts with short irons, but the 2 iron is just a nip of grass. Another reason why stronger lofts dont always mean more distance is something I do frequently to help golfers hit the ball farther weaken lofts. 759 Decided to get lofts and lie's double checked on my irons for peace of mind and following a gap check session get them bent 2 degree strong to the original manufacturer loft spec. GolfWRX_Spotted posted a topic in Tour and Pre-Release Equipment, Tuesday at 04:47 PM, GolfWRX_Spotted posted a topic in Tour and Pre-Release Equipment, February 20, GolfWRX_Spotted posted a topic in Tour and Pre-Release Equipment, February 13, GolfWRX_Spotted posted a topic in Tour and Pre-Release Equipment, February 6, GolfWRX_Spotted posted a topic in Tour and Pre-Release Equipment, January 31, By My miss is hitting it fat, so I was especially concerned with how bending them strong would affect bounce. Due to how DeChambeau delivers the club, his 4-iron has a stated loft of 16 degrees; the stock Ping i230 comes in at 22.5 degrees. Can someone please discuss the advantages and disadvantages of increasing loft on an iron by 2 degrees? Most people won't hit a 2 iron off the fairway though, so they probably won't take a divot at all As far as bounce goes, do you really think a club going 100 mph is going to be affected by 2 less of bounce? Would bending it serve the same result? My irons are bent weak partly to get the right launch conditions but also to reduce my draw. It has been working really well for me. You can easily bend the lofts and lies to be progressively consistent from one club to the next with zero tolerance. Even with the knowledge of club bending and its importance on your play, there are a lot of misconceptions about what can and cant be done with a clubs loft and lie. First, is it safe to have P790s bent that much? Adams A12 19 - Fuji HB 80X, PXG 0311X 4 - HZRDUS Red 105 X A standard golf shop, or fitting center will be able to do this. More photos from the event here. So you bend them 1 degree strong, bounce follows it by a degree. It, In any case one can't really compare clubs anymore with respect to asking what someone hit. The speed of putts is crucial. It is common for a golfer with a swing speed of 70-to-80 mph or less to hit the ball with a lower trajectory than what is considered ideal. This is especially true of clubs made with long hosels. Cast club heads made of industrial steel are all on the so-called "unbendable list". I've had plenty of clubs bent a degree or two and never had an issue with how the clubs performed, even a wedge. The lightweight speed designs dont seem to help the everyday golfer from the examples I see out on the course. I teach golf on the Eastern side of Michigan where I am the Director of Instruction for three golf courses. If the added ball speed of modern irons is not enough to achieve an ideal landing angle, I have to add loft. Fitters have to find some way to raise their ball flight, because those golfers lack the speed necessary to get the best results from many modern iron heads. I realize this can be affected by angle of attack, swing speed, iron/shaft design, and ball design. 4-6 more yards (depending on club and swing speed) and lower launch with less bounce. This is a list of all clubheads that clubmakers are not allowed to bend. Even if you want to say a weakened 4 iron is longer in length than a 5 iron of the same loft and therefore goes farther, your gaps in your set will still be equally proportionate. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Feb 3, 2013. On a driver? What affect would bending an iron 2 degrees stronger have? Thanks for everybody for your help! But Im not sure whats being accomplished with weakening irons. if we move from a "high launch" to a Low launch shaft, who reduce loft by 2* we also lost 2* bounce. Bending strong 2* decreases bounce by 2* and increases offset by about .75mm. I would be using it off the ground as well, a little of both. Restore formatting, Hi Greyson, Bending your irons strong will reduce the bounce of the club. JavaScript is disabled. I'm curious what effect bending the irons 1 or 2 degrees strong would have on the irons playability. Unless of course it's a long iron and you have a hard time elevating it in the first place. Machines that adjust for all hosel positions, such asMitchell Angle Machinesare accurate regardless of the offset or hosel design of the golf club. May 23, 2016 at 04:54 PM. I am in favor of weaker lofts. Taking the destructive shot out of your game is key. What amazes me the most is how many golfers will continually spend thousands of dollars on golf equipment but never take the initiative to change those fundamental things that will help them really improve their skills and abilities. Todays golf ball travels farther than ever before and I dont see any need to jack up the short iron lofts. Training Aids, GPS Devices, Apps, Accessories & More. Sorry to be a jerk but this topic comes up quite regularly so there are dozens of threads in the archives discussing this same topic. Ball- Bridgestone Tour B X, In the grand scheme of things, I would say zero effect. I was being fitted for MP-4's and the ball flight with the kbs tour x was a little higher than i wanted so my fitter was able to bend it strong incrementally by 1 degree to flatten out the ball flight for me. The difference after they were set to factory lofts and lie for my swing was amazing! That means judging any of this due to the club head alone and isolated makes no sense, we have to include the player and his delivery of the head since thats what matters for if we can / should go weaker or stronger or leave it as it is. Not fact but I do think more offset makes it easier to draw the ball. Ping Glide wedges w/Recoil 110 I suspect Ill be waiting a very long time, Amen, finally some one with great insight. You can post now and register later. I am now thinking I am just going to bend my 712 Ap2 irons to the 714 AP2 specs so my gaps will match up better with my wedges. Bravo, As a club fitter who deals with players that purchase equipment based on what their ego tells them they need verses the facts this is a breath of fresh air! When this happens, its usually the result of some type of inconsistency in the metallurgy of the club. A 4 iron only has 1 degree of bounce standard so will I have negative bounce when bent two degrees strong? I bent them 4 degrees strong to keep my flight down as I hit moon balls with my X700 shafts hardstepped X3 ", Ping G400 Testing G410. there comes a time when too much loft jacking is too much. Just curious but, can I bend a set of titleist cb718 to the titleist ap2 718 specs? You hit the golf ball off of the heel of the club often causing the golf ball to hook or pull, You are playing clubs too short for you (again. Definitely worth getting L/L check done and adjusted where necessary. So, if you really want to get better at golf, start by learning how to hold the club properly. TM TP UDi #3, MC 4-7, MB 8-P w/ Tour V S+ Potentially, this would mean the toe digs in and your shots go right (right handed). You must log in or register to reply here. Titleist U500 3 & 4 Oban Kiyoshi Purple Tour Reserve Since clubs are bent with iron bars by applying pressure on. It is a taylormade udi 2i that I want to bend from 18* to 16*. And the grip should be light enough to allow supple movement in the wrists during the swing. Haven't registered for Team Titleist yet? Study those players and mimic their set-up and you will take another giant step toward playing better golf. An ideal Launch Angle and Spin Rate for a Ball Speed with a 6 iron of 115 MPH would be right about 15-16* and 6000 RPMs respectively. Bending irons to remove offset? - WRX Club Techs - GolfWRX But what about the mid and low irons, yes I understand some companies make 6/7 hybrids (7 and up is very rare), but you can not really replace an 8 iron with a true hybrid. When I was fitted for my 714 AP-2's it was the Titleist fitter who suggested we go 1 degree strong, but it take very little divot. Surely getting consistent results and regular yardage gaps between clubs is more important than shooting for some ideal stats that may go against your natural swing? Can you bend a metal wood? On the short end, as the pitching wedge loft gets stronger you end up with wider gaps in the scoring clubs. 10.5 set at small - The refit yielded a super driving iron. So to get the most performance out of each iron, for these low ball hitters, we need to add loft. My 54 wedge has 12 of bounce and the divots I take with it are just a big as all the rest. Any knowledge on the subject would be appreciated. And visa versa, if the original bounce is low and/or the club has a sharp leading edge, the reduction in bounce may have a significant impact on playability. Mizuno JPX 921 Hot Metal. most amateurs like to hit the long ball not the low score. TM M2 8.5* Graphite Design Tour AD GP 6X+ You cannot paste images directly. Its not about research or information, its about ego and emotion. TM TPx. Good point. The bend overlap in angle iron will be bigger so you need to allow for a 1/2 inch. IG: golfer_scott I'm fascinated by your basis for changing the lofts? How to bend your clubs | Mitchell Golf - YouTube What to consider when bending golf clubs. Since loft and bounce is connected, and cant be split no matter what we do. Bending TM P790 irons up to 2 degrees weaker. Is it safe? Good idea? A typical #6 iron on the Tour is 31* on loft but Dynamic loft is average only 20.2 Humans think theyre logical but when it comes down to it (when the wallet hits the counter), they are controlled by feelings, who they wish they could play like and what company has qualities that match their identity. Taylor Made tour issue M2 T3 Ozik Matrix 8M3 X I've never had a sand wedge bent, I suppose that could be an issue but if you open the blade a bit the bounce comes back. What affect would bending an iron 2 degrees stronger have? You are also all correct in that it is a long iron. Ping G410 Plus Oban Kiyoshi Tour Limited I have read that if you bend 1 degree strong you lower the bounce on the iron. I will also need to bend my irons 2 degrees flat according to a lie board. Still, someone has to win, and, with such dead wood, punters might smile at this opportunity to nab the winner of an event returning to its status as an opposite event expect LIV to make an offer in 2024. Even forged clubheads made of the wrong steel . But they will still land on the green as soft as an older set of irons (if not softer). That is only if the area you are going to contact the ball moves up on the face as a result of bending, the lower portion of the face will move backwards when bent strong. You might as well get a distance gap before bending. This applies to both face angle and lie. Odyssey 2-ball Pro-Type milled face putter. There was only an added 2 yards with the stronger lofts of trackman. Reset Password (more on this down below). Ping G425 Max 10.5 - Ventus Black 6X or G425 LST Ventus - Black 7X, Ping G425 Max 14.5 - Ventus Blue 7X Thats not to say this exotic land doesnt bring a classy winner. A Good Fit for a Clubfitter is the Post Fit. What bounce does is keep the leading edge from digging into the ground. How much will bending an iron affect how it plays? It was suggested that I would bring my launch and spin down a bit with making my irons 1-2 stronger. 2 degrees upright - Club Fitting - Team Titleist When you start messing around with the hozzels and stress on clubs you need to know what you are doing. I showed him all the stats on the monitor and he was in agreement but when it came to buying the actual driver he insisted on buying the 9.5 head with the TP after all the work on the launch monitor. Im 62 and most GI clubs are too long even for me in their stock iteration with this progressive shaft lengths concept. Pros and cons? Haven't registered for Team Titleist yet?
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